[vindrums]

    Just another thought on the solo drumming;
    I never ever played solos. I won't say how many thousands (to fat to fight) of gigs without but I can remember each one, for a total of about ten. About 8 were with a little three piece backing up an old semi famous singer. One was when power went out in Key West, and I was ordered to play, and when I was leaving one band I had played with almost a year on the road, I got to play a farewell solo on the new guys kit! They were making a new video with the new guy, His kit was simmons pads plugged into an Octopad. 1986 BTW. the memories are pouring back; The rumor was I was leaving to get married....even though it was my last night, both drummers were told to be ready. That was a wild situation, that you don't get into often! Two drummers hanging out before gig (how many times does that happen in a one drummer band?) like a couple of college quarterbacks where both play....We both figured I'd get the call for the first set, and then Paull would do the rest of the night......So first set, dude gets the call, no big deal. I'm still getting paid, actually now that I think about it, he wasn't! And I was having thoughts about my own bed and wife and etc.. and of course etc. etc.. So they tell me I'm done and can change. So the whole place thinks I'm leaving to get married.....how many drinks do you think they bought me? Later in the night they tell me I've got a chance to perform on the video they were making......How to sober up in three minutes? Ain't happening! Played for 15, band comes back up on stage for big end....so that was really my first solo e-performance, unless you count the contribution of Ron Bacardi and call it a duo.
Vince 

[Orb Vroomer]

We all have  similar,yet different stories to tell like this .But I cant type fast & I hate typing.I'd rather have fun on the phone. We could probably talk for HOURS sharing these stories.You already know that.I want to start a subject in REF's new header or anyone can start it. It doesn't matter.It should be called WHERE have you/do you play your Kats. Then we can share more ideas , because it's a hard task to accomplish. I still have not entered the lighting post yet,because I keep tending to other matters......and I HATE typing.....& my back hurts lately....sound familiar ?   is THIS the first time I said that in here?  ...new info...clogging my brain buffers...racing around in my brain.....ninjam has to be figured out...other stuff....but I NEVER GIVE UP...& I REFUSE TO GIVE UP...

[REF]

Orb, I've been spending the entire day outside today, and not done yet. Exhausted. When I get the next chance, first I need to try Mario's suggestions to me on getting this Hart bass drum to work through the TK. Then I will turn on this Procussion and ask some ?s about that. Actually, there's a thread I started about that. I'll have to find it. I'll ask on there.

I'll have to print out your post and try that step by step on the MK to DK. I'll have to read it a few times to take it all in.

Later ....

[Orb Vroomer]

NO WINE-ING !! minor...went to doc...back to strict bland diet...BLAND DIET ?....don't like the sound of that....who stole my HOT SAUCE ?...orb...
Just lost a bunch of typing in other thread.....& I HATE TYPING.... "shut up Orb !! "....sorry ....redo it later or tomorrow.....orb...

[REF]

Bland diet? Interesting. My diet has changed alot recently, too . Gluten intolerance. No more wheat, etc. Bummer. Pizza. We make our own. Well, used to.

[Orb Vroomer]

I got real stressed out about 5 years ago trying to get this building ready in time for us to move the Creepy Crawl (ST Louis) across town.  { Last time I checked their web site  was up -no link -google it-it has some pics on there of both buildings}  [ It had MY PA in there & I was FOH engineer there for 6 years-{look @ 39 most annoying things bands say} & you'll get an idea of 1 place I could play. ] It was small ,but we could jam 350 people  in there.A lot of interesting shows were there--punk ska,metal,alt,hard core,straight edge,experimental,etc & just about any band who could rattle drinks off the bar.White Stripes played there once--Fallout Boy,Bad Brains, & we had bands from everywhere in that grimy place--US ,Canada,Europe,Russia,Japan,etc. I lost a lot of weight trying to get that building ready on time,that didn't happen ,though. Too many hours .

Now , I got this acid reflux & I lost weight again.I usually weigh 175, stepped on scale today---155.... CC ran 6 nights a week/ 5-7 per night--with 15min.change over-& we always ran on time. If the bands set up too slow --tough--your set ended @ set time.
The doc said I'm @ my ideal weight right now.My 36" pants are falling off- I wore 34'" @ time of contest vid. I think I'll get my 32" out of storage.
Gluten su......! --a relative of mine has that--I think your food choices might be more limited than mine. That su.....! It's almost 12:30 --time for bed.
Orb needs to dock in bed chamber bay.
Just downloaded a duo concert from 1990.My genius friend Chris wrote this incredible symphonic piece we did.Oh yeah --it starts with him solo on his MIDI DATA GLOVE he made.He works @ Pixar now (too bad for me,good for him). & I think a video is on the way too---file too big to download--30 min. show.I forgot just how good that show was,until I just heard it. I'll share as soon as possible. If you heard the audio- & I told you it was a live duo-you'd call me a liar,so I hope I can get the video.The sound is off the camera mic @ back of small theater--but it sounds way better than I thought it would. When Vince & I are done with you --maybe you and your wife will be able to do a show like that. Get on that programming advice I gave you or you'll never be able to pull it off.
orb.

[REF]

Ugh. Right now stuff is all over the house because I'm painting in the music room. Then one more room after that.

Tell me this. When you decide to do a piece, what comes first? Is it simply placing /assigning bass and snare and whatever time keeping sounds you will use? Then begin adding melodic sounds on pads? Then begin stacking notes? How do you go about establishing a set up?

[Orb Vroomer]

Common things here.When I built my basement studio --I changed it from' hanging blanket walls & concrete floors' to drywall & carpet, so I know about that !


How do I program ? OK. But let me tell YOU how to work.

You asked about key playing & I advised.YOU asked about guitar playing & I advised. You will need some of those skills to do this.
Having said that:


Once you make the smallest amount of progress ,your on your way. Why ? Guess what ? Drums are still your main inst.--you know that....but...


But if you can play a couple of chords on guitar,you can ALSO PLAY THEM ON YOUR KATS !!!! & your a drummer & this will be simple..&...Guess what else ?
You will be able to play complicated chords easier on Kats--since it's your instrument !!
Now...remember your ideas about human nature & man's desire to socialize ? Great point.

Elton is an excellent composer ,but....Bernie writes all the lyrics ! It just works better that way for him--everybody is DIFFERENT !

A omb can never have some of the interaction you described somewhere earlier --you can get help--but ultimately your BY YOURSELF.
Other examples: Do you know who Danny Elfmann is ? He had Oingo Boingo in 80's--no more.He started other pursuits --Pee Wee Herman movie sound tracks & then work with Tim Burton---Dark Man,Bat Man & on & on & on .Did  you know he wrote that Simpsons theme song ? He is one of my biggest heroes !!! I STILL LOVE Oingo Boingo to this day !!! I'll bet he doesn't work alone.....but .....he isn't in a BAND anymore !!!

Onto how I work. It can start anywhere. A beat,a sound on keys,a pattern on any sound---tuned sounds,percussion sounds etc .Like your video entry-anything is a starting point.Once you 'fool around' on other inst. & sounds YOUR starting point will occur out of nowhere--any idea !!
So it could be a simple bass line,drum patterns,chord progressions,etc.That isn't consistent--& does not matter.It is hard to put all together,but you'll figure that out ,too.Check my post that talks of "stacked vertical columns of notes" in an earlier post.That's how I WORK. Try viewing it from a conductor's score point of view, if you can picture that. Once you grasp that concept it will become clearer.

Why don't I E you a 'jungle beat' song I did as a live DUO.If you want to ,maybe ,work with your wife,you can do songs like that.Or you can do it alone.
Let me know what you think,& we will proceed.   orb....

[vindrums]

    Orb is right! tunes can start anywhere, and many times they start with a sound or a beat....but how about today? If this was a lesson towards getting you to play more with your KAT I would suggest:
   Get that chord chart, if you don't have it, then for today:
 Pick three pads on the Trap on a kit you already have drums set up on, pick a sound (give up three toms for now)....in mult mode, put a C on one an F on the next, and G on the next. Experiment and set the gate time to almost a bars worth of time. If you find a sound that morphs over the four counts, that makes it that much cooler.
Now play a drumset part, and attempt to play C for 4 then F for 4 then G for 4 and then back to C for 4 while you continue the drums. So you'll have to leave your ride or hat for that note, (if you are using your right and playing 8ths) so you can link it to your hat. If trap doesn't link then you'll have to actually add a hat or ride note to the melodic multis we set up. Later you can add more notes to the melodic pads to make a chord.
      Thats the whole lesson, and I think one of the simplest starts to melodic addition to drumset.
   
Vince

[Orb Vroomer]

Vince has unlocked the SECRET OF ROCK & ROLL TO ALL !!! He 'SIMPLIFIED' it for you.


The" THREE CHORD SONG"  !!!    amazing isn't it ?


Remember how I told you on 2 different posts to learn "Free Fallin" by Tom Petty (3 times now)  !! & then I sent you to lesson #2 with EL&P's "Lucky Man"----advancing you to a 4 CHORD SONG !!!!  I new you liked EL&P ,that's why I chose it & told you "Don't try to pick it like Greg ? "Just strum along (on guitar ) & have fun !

Now , with my latest post I said "It will be easier to play on YOUR INSTRUMENT !! "---  & it doesn't have to be a guitar sample your triggering.Any "TUNED SAMPLE SOUND " will  work. & if you want lesson #3-----instead of gate , use a sustain pedal under left foot to control different duration times for the different chords. Vince & I also mentioned that earlier in thread. Vince & I can't live/work without a sus. ped.  Hey Vince ,I never gave lessons ,but you did &....Maybe we should start an E-Drummer School !!!!!!    Hey Vince----- Why don't you call me today--I don't have your #.
I think I'll fire up" FAB FOUR " software now,& "strum along on my keyboard with my 1966 Martin D-28 acoustic guitar (sample) "  .
In "Lucky Man" the D chord plays around with a 4th & the G chord plays around with a 9th (if I had $1 for every D4 in rock songs---I wouldn't be a millionaire--but I'd have a big pile of cash).----,but you are not ready for lesson 4 ,YET. You have to complete 1,2,& 3 before advancing.

orb.

[REF]

Hmm. So, what I think I will do is use some rim pads for melody lines. I'll find that easier to get along with.

I am confused about one thing. Chords. A C is a single note, etc. Not sure what kind of chordal structures my TDW20 offers. It doesn't have much by way of melodic instruments. Although, I have not really checked that out in detail. I'll have to figure that out with some time in the manual. But if I want to play chords do I assume correctly I have to stack notes?

I think I will also spend some more time watching the contest vids and see what kind of structures are being employed. But for me, I lean towards fusion musically. I think if I can figure out the TDW20 I can put something together. When I do I'll send you a DVD to critique. Tell me what you think.

[Orb Vroomer]

REF does the TK have the alts like the DK ? I don't have a manual-but you do. Try to see what is missing -if anything from Trap K -Drum K. Does Trap K have the 4 note 'stacks' or whatever it's called ? If so,use those to build you chords.You are not a synth tweaker,so I would stay away from transposing of the modules sounds-besides transpose is a chromatic function ,& you'll likely get things 'mucked up' that way.Your  3 chord approach won't work very well-some intervals might work.

For melody notes,use alts,if the TK has that,because that's how I do it. .I would use alts & then have a series of notes on only ONE pad. &, since I know you want more pads, none will be wasted by putting individual notes spread around a bunch of pads.Only one series of order ,though, until it loops back. Maybe Vince does it differently.On Mission that WEEL passes & trigs a synth that I programed just for that.I had to because I didn't have enough pads to play it otherwise.And it took every pad up there to do it-no spares.I don't hit LISA, it but it is linked to an upper R pad (I think ) with other notes I need to keep rhythm pattern complete-it was almost an IMPOSSIBLE MISSION. Didn't see that before the fact,like my silly metaphors I  always use to punish you guys !

So on WEEL-melody,& through out the song, DK is an alt 8 (individual notes) that plays 3 notes synth notes I had to specially program.So technically,8 (alt) notes X 3 synth notes plays 24 notes on one pad. (I can barely follow that).Last of 8 is a 2 note deal,so it comes up as 23,actually.Holt Sh....That does sound almost IMPOSSIBLE. Don't try this @ home ,kids.Is your brain mush yet ? How about you,REF ?

If TDW20 isn't like Proteus ,use that or Procussion for chords. We're getting advanced here--so don't pass go -or you might have to go directly to jail & be fined !!!

Get lesson 1,2,&3 ready before this. If I ever get back to lighting thread, I'll break it into ind. chapters--might look never ending otherwise. 
I would assume you to use stacked notes for your chords REF. I don't use all the DK functions --so there is likely more than on path to top of mountain !! orb.

[pljones]

Yes, the TK pads do layering - on the 3.1, 1-4 notes per pad (1-3 on a hi-hat pad x 2 for open/closed).

You could just use the one pad if your module does do chords - Alt 4 set to C-E-G-C.

[Orb Vroomer]

Thanks,......Did you hear that REF ?.  I just have DK's ,but thanks for telling us.I don't have a unit or manual for TK. Just trying to be helpful-like you--pljones.
orb.

[REF]

I might be mistaken, but I thought the new TK 4.0 can stack 6 or 16 notes per pad. I forget.

Ultimately I am thinking I want to have the Yamaha module, which can do ... 16 I think, plus the opinions of those who just think the drums sound better. I am giving up on separate pads, too. I want another midi device. TrapKat, whatever. The extra wires drive me crazy. Crosstalk and false triggering issues. Sensitivity or lack thereof. More hardware to hook them all up. Not the road I want to travel on. May as well stay with my acoustic set up for all the stuff I am ending up with.

So, time to sell all my cymbals. A decision I have been dreading. But, they are sitting in cases now and aren't going to get set up again, more than likely. Time to just go electronic and get over it. Smaller footprint. More control. More options.